Bezier Lathe for 2.111

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Bezier Lathe for 2.111

Postby thyme » 07 Oct 2006, 01:26

2.111 is ready for download from:

http://www.seamless3d.com/download

This is the first version to use Bezier lathes which make seamless much more intuitive than ever before to make smooth curvy shapes.
I am sorry this version took longer than I expected. I barked up the wrong tree for some of the time which is inevitable if you want to test the best way to do things and digging a poor cow out of a muddy hole delayed things further.
Though there are a few loose ends still left, I decided to upload this version now, in time for the weekend because the important things are working to demonstrate the new BezierLathe.
I have in fact added 2 different Bezier lathe nodes:

BezierLathe Image
BezierLatheBuild Image

The BezierLathe Image node is used like a CCLathe node in the sense that it is used as a child of a SurfaceGenerator node. This makes branch joining possible.

The BezierLatheBuild Image node is simpler and easier to use for a beginner. It is designed with the same idea in mind for the new specialised build nodes, the SphereBuild, CylinderBuild, ConeBuild etc. where you just need one node and a part reference for it to make something.

To play with the BezierLatheBuild node:

create a new smls file Image

select the part Image node if it is not already selected and then click on the BezierLatheBuild Image from the main (horizontal) tool bar

then you should see a Bezier lathe set up ready to be played with:

Image

Any of the green and cyan coloured dots (the control points for the Bezier curve) can be dragged to alter the shape.
I have made it so that the part's vertices can not be clicked on until you select a different type of node to a Bezier. This helps to prevent accidentally selecting a part node.

If you have not already noticed from the BezierLatheBuild being on the main (horizontal) toolbar as well as the new node bar (vertical), some build nodes can now be added from the main tool bar.
It seemed silly to have immediate spheres, cylinders, and rectangles available from the toolbar when the SphereBuild CylinderBuild nodes can be used for immediate editing soon as the build node is deleted. This not only makes seamless simpler overall, it makes seamless easier to get started using build nodes. In tune with this spirit, the ImmediateRectangle has been replaced with the RectangleBuild node.

I think this version will mark the beginning of a new era, where Seamless not only will be seen as a 3d modeller that gives the user a lot of power under the finger tips but also a modeller that is fun and very easy for a beginner to use. Perhaps I am biased from the fact I know seamless better than any other 3d modeller but in the past few weeks I have played with various 3d editing programs and have come across nothing else that is as simple to make curvy lathe shapes.
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Postby Alain » 07 Oct 2006, 08:23

LOOLLLL

I tried it quickly ......

seems wonderful :)

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Postby Lilly » 07 Oct 2006, 08:28

Wow thymou thanks much! I just come to download it and investigated in two minutes possibility who seem to me completely infinite, it is really the magnificent work which you made there, and I do not doubt that my imagination will take advantage of it... Still thank you....
bisous
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Postby Lilly » 07 Oct 2006, 15:14

Lilly's nodes_car ehehehehe bisouxoxoxoxoxoxo thymou !

(Realized in 10 minutes very easily)

Image

Antique vase ehehe

Image

wonderfull thymou it is brilliant what you made for the novices woooow!!!! Ehehheheh we are going to be well able to enjoy themselves with seamless!!! bisouxoxoxoxoxoxoxox
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Postby thyme » 07 Oct 2006, 22:27

Lol Alain you must be the first to have made a woman using the new Bezier lathe node! :) This is not quite how I envisioned making the breasts using a Bezier lathe node but lol it is a first!!! :) BranchJoining would be good for this but it will have to be a little more complicated but I have hope this can be made relatively easy :P

Nice Vase Lilly, vases, wine glasses, hour glasses and women's waist naturally spring to mind when using a Bezier lathe :)
Your car is a good example of something that can be made using the new Build nodes in general. It looks very neatly made and a little bit like a rocket launcher lol.

Thanks much dear Alain and dear Lilly for your photos of your seamless creations, they may be ultra fast creations but I love them :P and could not have hoped for more pleasing results in such a short time :)

bisousssssssssssss :P
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Postby Lilly » 07 Oct 2006, 22:42

merci thymou

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Postby Alain » 08 Oct 2006, 13:19

a little more complicated but I have hope this can be made relatively easy


girls are more complicated than seamless .....

but I am not a specialist ......:)

ps : will tell you the probs I ahd to outpust ,
coz I don't need if it is necessary to "complile" ans I had been not able to keep the shape when ouputed it ,

but I tried quickly ....:(
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Postby thyme » 08 Oct 2006, 14:51

Sorry Alain! but I think I know what the problem is.

The problem is you don't want to do immediate editing (such as tugging vertices) on a part that is also being built by a build node. This often catches Ep out and occasionally me :) Afraid Even compile transform wont do anything here because the build node will simply re build everything from scratch next time the build nodes are triggered to build (changing a build node's field causes all the build nodes to rebuild). The only way to stop build nodes rebuilding everything is to delete them! but there are better ways to make breasts using build nodes which I will show in a tutorial hopefully soon. I want to next get a step by step tutorial showing how to begin making an avatar using a minimum of concepts (using build nodes) and then make a bee line for showing how to add gestures. Then I can show ways this simple avatar can be improved and explain more concepts along the way.

Sorry for this confusion Alain, for this version I wanted to make seamless warn the user if they tug a vertex that belongs to a part that is built by a build node, the tugs will be lost unless they delete the build node but I ran out of time for this weekend. Its something that should make seamless a lot friendlier but also I can see if build nodes are taught first and immediate editing kept for more advanced tasks (such as editing triangles at the flat stage), this problem is going to be less likely encountered by a beginner.
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Postby Alain » 08 Oct 2006, 15:15

don't worry ,Thyme , take your time , I am not in a hurry to build breasts LOOOOL ,
I just wondered if I was false , and indeed I tried all that too quickly .....

But the node is very nice , i is a fact !!

btw I saw that you used the same sort of way kekenken used


http://www.ceres.dti.ne.jp/~kekenken/ma ... uro2cd.wrl

if I am not too wrong
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Postby thyme » 09 Oct 2006, 23:11

Deleting a build node so that immediate editing can be performed is a perfectly legit way to use seamless Alain however once the build node is deleted much of the benefits are gone such as being able to adjust the curve or the density of the triangles plus build nodes make smls files a fraction of the size.

btw I saw that you used the same sort of way kekenken used


thanks for the example Alain, it is indeed very simular to seamless's Bezier lathe node and is nice and straight forward to use just like seamless's bezier lathe however I have never seen this example before but this is not surprising because splines are of course a very standard way of making curves for both 2d and 3d and most 3d programs also use a lathe type object though some use a different name, rhino3d uses the word "Revolve" for a lathe:

http://members.tripod.com/~fyre3d/hat.htm

The question is what took me so long to use splines? lol
It would have seemed a natural evolutionary step for seamless to use spline curves years ago for it's lathes and I did think of doing just this years ago but I persisted with circular and elliptical curves until recently because they had always got good results and I found it harder to make rounded curves using a catmullrom type spline.

Try comparing the CatmullRom:

http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~lambert/spl ... llRom.html

to the bezier (the last example)

http://www.ibiblio.org/e-notes/Splines/Bezier.htm

to make a rounded shape.

The CatmullRom can be smooth but does not so natuarlly push the user into making smooth shapes like the bezier.

Recently I have played with free demos and programs like bender, rino3d, flux studio and white dune which all use splines of some kind.
Despite rino3d, costing lots of money and no doubt it is a very sophisticated program, none of the 3d modelling programs I tried were as straight forward to use as this minimalist java applet for a bezier curve.

Perhaps there is good reason why these programs are the way they are and if i was more at home with them I would find them easy to use but for a complete newbie this simple bezier java applet must be much easier to control and seamless's Bezier lathe does not get distacted from this simplicity nor does the kekenken lathe.

PS

while searching i recently found cinema4d uses bezier curves to control it's lathes:

http://www.4dtutorials.com/Lathe%20NURB ... lines.html

and i have seen they are also meantioned for 3d studio max
perhaps seamless was the only 3d program that did not use splines lol though I have recently discovered terms like "circular spline" and "eliptical spline"

http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q ... %3Dlang_en

so seamless's traditional CCLathes and ECLathes could be considered splines too :)
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Postby Alain » 10 Oct 2006, 05:33

did you tried Art of Illusion ? it uses a java machine but don't know how ...

a free nice prog

http://dumenieu.free.fr/louiseforum/art ... curves.wrl
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Postby thyme » 11 Oct 2006, 02:01

Interesting line drawn face Alain, did you draw it using art of elusion? looks like the lines were made with splines?
The name "Art of illusion" sounds familiar (probably Omind mentioned it in his progie guide) but I have never used it. The gallery looks good. I see it does ray tracing (same technique pov-ray uses)
Java anything usually means extra slow unless its really trivial but I will try downloading it, seeing it's free and because you tipped it Alain :)
Last edited by thyme on 16 Nov 2006, 06:36, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Alain » 11 Oct 2006, 06:29

I dont know how it makes things ,
but I tried it at school
( coz it is free )

http://louisedesavoie.forumactif.com/ft ... lusion.htm
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Postby bumpy » 21 Oct 2006, 05:05

Hi thyme :D

This Bezier lathe is the best lathe I have ever used!
I made this brandy cup in less than 10 minutes 8)
It's so intuitive and I love how the curves are always generated so smoothly and the triangle bands are distributed to give the best results for a low triangle count.
This is great work thyme :D .

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Postby Lilly » 21 Oct 2006, 11:54

Hello bumpy
nice brandy cup !
my bull-terrier " courbes de Bezier " ;o))


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